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Author Topic: Stewart/Kahne  (Read 2837 times)
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17RoushFan
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« on: July 11, 2004, 10:07:34 PM »

Whoa! Stewart & Kahne's crews are in a fight. Man, Stewart continues to get in the news!
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 tuned in to watch some commercials, but when they went to break, i saw a nascar race!
sally
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« Reply #1 on: July 12, 2004, 12:48:29 AM »

Won't it be interesting to see what, if anything Nascar does now that
Ray Evernham is the one raising...sorry, I can't help myself...Kahne.
 :wink: Sally
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Vivian
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« Reply #2 on: July 12, 2004, 02:33:54 AM »

I sure got an earful at home.  Finally had to tell Don to shut up about the whole deal and to remember this was a totally separate incident than the others Tony had been in.  Now for my feelings about it and I think I am being objective.  Looks like Tony had a run and when he came down into line it happened that Kasey was lifting and Tony barely touched him.  There were no big dents in Tony's bumper.  As far as Ray, I think he may re-evaluate once he studies the tape and hears Kasey say he was loose at that time and ready to shift.  Wally explained it well, imo.
I definitely want to hear everyone else's thoughts on the incident.  If all of you think it was deliberate and intentional, then I will re-think my opinion.

Fines only for the crew chiefs, none for Tony is what I think Nascar will do.
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Cheryl
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« Reply #3 on: July 12, 2004, 12:35:50 PM »

Quote from: "Vivian"
I sure got an earful at home.  Finally had to tell Don to shut up about the whole deal and to remember this was a totally separate incident than the others Tony had been in.  Now for my feelings about it and I think I am being objective.  Looks like Tony had a run and when he came down into line it happened that Kasey was lifting and Tony barely touched him.  


I'm sorry, Vivian, I have to disagree.  I think this just shows more of the same impatience that Tony has shown all year long.  Kahne was the leader and you have to respect the leader, whether you have a "run" going or not.  It's not like its the first time we've seen someone up front with only two tires or no new tires.  Yet other drivers with four tires and a good car manage to avoid running into them and taking out a bunch of other cars in the process.  

I have to agree with the guys on that program last week on PRN, I think NASCAR is too afraid of Home Depot and Gibbs to properly penalize Tony.  Instead he gets to sit in Victory Lane while Kahne, Jeff Burton, and others sat in the garage with torn up race cars.  

I can only compare this to the officiating I've seen at USAR races this year.  It doesn't matter even if it's a former champion who wrecks someone (accident or not), he gets placed at the end of the longest line.  Funny how that can be done so easily in a smaller series, yet in the "top" stock car series,  there are too many political considerations...As NBC said just before this happened, NASCAR has a serious credibility problem.

Cheryl
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ronbarnes77
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« Reply #4 on: July 12, 2004, 03:03:37 PM »

don't agree that it's totally stewart's fault.it looked to me like the 9 miss a shift and tony ran into the back of him.did you guys read about everham threat?
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BAM24/25
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« Reply #5 on: July 12, 2004, 04:06:54 PM »

I also don't see it quite as clear cut as some.  Kasey looked like he got loose and Tony ran into the back of him, but I also think Tony could have backed off.  He didn't and just kept going.  Tony's problem is his history.  When someone does things intentionally so many times that the one time it may be unintentional nobody believes him.
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You can't beat what you can't catch!"

Vivian
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« Reply #6 on: July 12, 2004, 05:12:46 PM »

We have some good varying views here.  That is great.  Come on, Everyone, jump in.  Any other views?  Was it a racing deal?  Could Tony have backed off more and sooner?  I have this "need" to really know.
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Lou
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« Reply #7 on: July 12, 2004, 07:14:57 PM »

Quote from: "Vivian"
We have some good varying views here.  That is great.  Come on, Everyone, jump in.  Any other views?  Was it a racing deal?  Could Tony have backed off more and sooner?  I have this "need" to really know.

I certainly do NOT think it was intentional. I think it was indeed a "racing deal". That being said, I also think that Tony Stewart is supposed to be one of the elite, top, professional drivers in the world and should have had a better sense for the speed differential and closing rate going into turn 1. Yes, it all happened so fast and maybe he did not have time to get his foot on the brake pedal, but he is expected to based on his skill level. At the rate of speed at which he passed Sterling on the outside on the restart he should have know that he was going to be closing in on Kahne's bumper real quick-like....

It did not look to me like Kahne bobbled or slowed or missed a shift or anything except maintain the speed at which he was traveling.

Had the roles been reversed, the anouncers and fans would have been calling it a "rookie mistake".

Sorry Cheryl. It was a good "no call".  Am I grounded now?  :wink:

Lou
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Cheryl
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« Reply #8 on: July 12, 2004, 08:08:03 PM »

Quote from: "Lou"
Quote from: "Vivian"
Sorry Cheryl. It was a good "no call".  Am I grounded now?  :wink:


I think you're becoming the official Tony Stewart apologist around our house, dear.  If I said he was an angel, you'd decide he was the devil.   :wink:

I do agree that he didn't do it on purpose, but as you said he should've known the closing rate if he is as good as everyone always claims.  I think that is what bugs me so much.  If a rookie had done it, I would've still thought they were being impatient; however, you can excuse that more with a rookie rather than with a former champion and someone who's been restarting stock cars for how many years now?

I just think if you compare what he did to what Jason Leffler lost 11 positons for last week for running hard on the next to the last lap of the race, there seems to be a lot of disparate treatment.  Not that I am surprised since that seems to be NASCAR's MO lately.

Cheryl
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sally
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« Reply #9 on: July 12, 2004, 08:15:35 PM »

I agree, Cheryl.  If you penalize one driver for an incident, you have to penalize them all the same.    If they penalize Leffler, they have to penalize Stewart.  As you say, he IS one of bestdrivers out there.  Or so they keep telling us, right?
Sally :?
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Lou
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« Reply #10 on: July 12, 2004, 08:30:03 PM »

Quote from: "Cheryl"
I just think if you compare what he did to what Jason Leffler lost 11 positons for last week for running hard on the next to the last lap of the race, there seems to be a lot of disparate treatment.

You're not exactly comparing apples to apples. Leffler had 2 incidents within the span of 2 turns and a backstretch. I do not believe that NASCAR specified if he was being penalized for one or both, and if it were for just one, then which one? Did anyone hear their reasoning? I suspect he was penalized for the second incident, blocking, because NASCAR had already put teams on notice that they were not going to tolerate blocking.

We'll never really know, but I think that if he had not commited the second boo-boo, Leffler would not have received any penalty. I think NASCAR would have not been happy with the first incident but still would have probably chalked it up to the dreaded "racing incident". The second one could be considered an "aggravating circumstance" - in more ways than one :-)

So there... :mrgreen:

Lou
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« Reply #11 on: July 12, 2004, 08:32:56 PM »

I'm pretty much with Lou on this one. However, to expect Tony to have time to "back off", I think is a bit silly, considering the speed at which this stuff is happening. Even though Tony is one of the best,  I think his fault was in passing Sturlin' and squeezing in at that point anyhow. Things were too tight for that kind of move, as the results demonstrated.
  As good as these guys are, there are still some limits.  
Dick
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sally
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« Reply #12 on: July 12, 2004, 08:52:32 PM »

Lou, I heard an interview with Jason Leffler before the Busch race Sat, and he said Nascar told him the penalty was for the 2 incidents in half a lap.
Sally
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Vivian
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« Reply #13 on: July 12, 2004, 09:33:49 PM »

Dick, Don said practically the same thing you did.

I found this article on Jayski  http://sports.yahoo.com;nascar/news;ylc=X30DMTBqZ2Y4MzhzBF9T
and thought it was a good way of looking at it.

Lou, your opinion was good and I don't think you can compare Lefler's to Stewart's.  Lefler went up to block Jr and he was blatent about just running into Mikey whereas Tony did squeeze in a spot that maybe he should not have but then, Kasey did say he couldn't get going on restarts all day.  So where is the line?  None, it's just Tony & his rep.   :?
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Smallblock bored
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« Reply #14 on: July 13, 2004, 04:08:00 AM »

Well to be honest there are a few points that nobody has had the pleasure of hitting on. First foo these cars are way to dependent on the front down force to turn in the corners. By the same account the spoiler plays too much into the fact of "pressing the ass end" Look to Rusty Wallace and Sterling Marlin for the true answers. If that does not satisfy you then look to the past. These heaps depend way too much on body lines for the traction when going around the track. Sterling said it best a year and a half ago when he said "YOU JUST TOUCH THESE THINGS AND AROUND YOU GO" Jeff Green and Kane were victims of semi flat tracks and the new age areo cars. Wait till "the car of the future appears". We will all be sick of this sport pretty quick. (the true veterans I mean)
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